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Why does everybody (at least that I have ever seen), say "borei pri hagefen" first of all during havdallah, but not drink the wine until all of the other brachos have been said? Is saying the other brachos not a hefsek? How is the wine different from the spices, which I have always seen people smell immediately after making "borei minei bsamim"?

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    ואין לשאול: למה בקידוש והבדלה ברכת "בורא פרי הגפן" קודמת לשארי ברכות, ובברכת המזון היא מאוחרת? דאינו דומה, דקידוש והבדלה הוי התחלת העניין, וברכת הכוס קודמת לשארי הברכות, ולא הוי הפסק דמעניינא הוא he.wikisource.org/wiki/… Feb 18, 2013 at 16:20
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    It says don't ask!
    – Seth J
    Feb 18, 2013 at 16:40
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    Related: meta.judaism.stackexchange.com/q/1475/5
    – Seth J
    Feb 18, 2013 at 16:46
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    The same question applies to kiddush, bris milah, erusin...
    – Double AA
    Feb 18, 2013 at 17:36
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    the fact that it is a hefsek is the basis for the minhag that woman do not drink from the havdala wine, for being that it is a safek if a woman is mechuyeves to say minei ha'eish the bracha would be considered a hefsek between the hagafen and the drinking, and if they were to drink it would be devoid of the hagafen. somehow it became they grow beards because of it...figure that one out Nov 3, 2014 at 12:50

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The reason being, that there are 2 types of Borei Pri Hagefen.

The first type is the classic one: You want to drink wine and you first have to make a Bracha. This is called ברכת הנהנין - a Bracha before enjoying something.

The second type is the "Shira" type. The Borei Pri Hagefen is the Bracha we use in that case - we then say other Brachot - and then somebody drinks some wine, if possible. It's more of a ברכת המצוות - a bracha said on the Mitzva at hand.

Examples are: Sheva Brachot, Brit Mila, Havdala and Kiddush.

Sources: שערי נישואין by ר' יהודה טשזנר, Ofakim 2009.

He's discussing whether the 7 Brachot can be said by 7 people, or whether you have to have the same person make the first 2 Brachot.

He brings the שו"ת להורות נתן in ח"ד אה"ע סי' ק"ה:

וז"ל: אין ראוי לחלק ברכת בורא פרי הגפן מברכת אירוסין או מברכת חתנים, דדווקא אם מברכים אותן ביחד יש מקום לומר דגם ברכת היין הוי בגדר ברכת המצוות משום דאין אומרים שירה אלא על היין, ונעשה גם ברכת היין כברכת המצוות ומוציא לאחרים ואף אם הוא לא ישתה, אבל כשמברך ברכת היין בלבד ואינו שותה ואינו אומר עליו שירה, איך יהיה ברכת היין כברכת המצוות, עכ"ל. ‏

In essence, if you only say Borei Pri Hagefen wihtout some type if Shira, then you'd have to drink some of the wine. If you also say the secnod Bracha (of the 7 Brachot) then the Borei Pri Hagefen is a ברכת המצוות.

Anyway, we see from here that there is a concept of Borei Pri Hagefen that belongs to the next Bracha to form a Mitzva (Kidush, Havdala, etc.) and drinking the wine is secondary and waits until after the Mitzva is done.

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  • So if you have no wine, you still say it?
    – Double AA
    Sep 3, 2014 at 15:09
  • @DoubleAA - see my new edits. דאין אומרים שירה אלא על היין - so if there's no wine there's no ceremony. Sep 4, 2014 at 8:42
  • If you make havdalah over chamar medina so you say shehakol, you would drink still at the end. If you make kiddush on bread you say hamotzi then kiddush before you eat any bread. So it is not the b'racha itself but the fact it is part of a ceremony.
    – CashCow
    Mar 21, 2016 at 17:02

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