Are there any mekoros/reasons as to why many siddurim say that Veshomru (on Friday night after Hashkiveinu) and Mogein Ovos (in brocho mei'ein sheva) should be said by the congregation first and then the chazan?

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    Which Siddurim say that? – Double AA Jun 15 '18 at 14:45
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    In many parts of davening, the Chazzan repeats what the congregation said. – Salmononius2 Jun 15 '18 at 14:45
  • I think that common davening routine is to have the congregation go first. It's in Kedusha, responses to Kaddish, Shema (Chazan repeats last 3 words after Cong. has said it.) and many other places. I don't see these two cases as being unusual. – DanF Jun 15 '18 at 14:45
  • @salmon what you most likely mean to say is in many times in davening the congregation says the chazzan's stuff before him. – Double AA Jun 15 '18 at 14:51
  • @dou Is the last line of a birchas k”s “the chazan’s stuff”? – msh210 Jun 16 '18 at 20:54

The Shulchan Oruch O Ch 268, 8 says

ואומר שליח צבור ברכה אחת מעין שבע ואין היחיד אומר אותה: הגה מיהו אם היחיד רוצה להחמיר על עצמו יכול לאומרה (כב) בלא פתיחה ובלא חתימה וכן נוהגין הצבור לאמרה עם שליח צבור בלא פתיחה וחתימה (אבודרהם וכל בו):

And the Chazzan says the blessing of “Mogein Ovos” and the individual does not say it. (The Rema adds:) however if the individual wants to be strict with himself and say it, he can do so but without the opening and closing blessings and this is the custom that the congregation say it with the Chazzan without the opening and closing blessings.

On the words “without the opening and closing blessings” the Mishna Berurah sk 22 says:

בלא פתיחה וחתימה - כי עיקר התקנה היה שהש"ץ יברך אותה ע"כ נראה פשוט שמה שנוהגין באיזה מקומות שהש"ץ אומר בקול רם רק עד קונה שמים וארץ ואח"כ אומר בלחש לא יפה הן עושין אלא אחר שסיימו הקהל יתחיל הוא מגן אבות בקול רם:

Because the main institution is that the Chazzan says it. Therefore it seems obvious that the custom in certain places that the Chazzan says it aloud only up to קונה שמים וארץ and then says it quietly is not a good thing to do. But after the congregation have finished, the Chazzan should start מגן אבות aloud.

The mekor for the siddur instruction for Mogen Ovos is this Mishna Berurah. My guess at the reason is that since the main institution is that the Chazzan says it, the Chazzan will not be heard if the congregation say it at the same time. So the congregation can say it first and then the Chazzan.

  • Anything about Veshameru? – Kazi bácsi Jun 20 '18 at 10:53
  • @Kazibácsi For Veshameru, Artscroll siddur does say congregation first and then the chazan. But Koren Sacks siddur says "congregation together with the Leader". – Avrohom Yitzchok Jun 20 '18 at 20:43
  • I know both customs, but by chance are you aware of their sources? – Kazi bácsi Jun 20 '18 at 21:08

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