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If 10 people gathered for a minyan for the repetition of the amida, but 10 were NOT present for the silent Amida - may a repetition with kedusha be recited or not?

  • Maybe I wasn’t clear. I’m saying if you had 9 people for the silent and then a 10th arrived - is that considered a minyan that can repeat the amida? Above seems to be saying if there were 10 people to begin and now the chazzan wants to repeat the amida, there is a minimum amount of people required to answer amen. That is not what I’m referring to at all. – Draizy-Levi Pine Jan 26 '18 at 0:24
  • @DanF according to the kitzur shulchan oruch, you need six people that davened with you till now ( 20. 9) אֵין אוֹמְרִים תְּפִלַּת שְׁמֹנֶה עֶשְׂרֵה בְּקוֹל, אֶלָּא אִם כֵּן יֵשׁ לְכָל הַפָּחוֹת שִׁשָּׁה אֲנָשִׁים, שֶׁהֵם רֹב מִנְיָן שֶׁהִתְפַּלְּלוּ עַתָּה. אֲבָל אִם אֵין שִׁשָּׁה אֲנָשִׁים שֶׁהִתְפַּלְּלוּ עַתָּה, אֵין אוֹמְרִים כָּל הַשְּׁמֹנֶה עֶשְׂרֵה בְּקוֹל, אֶלָּא אֶחָד אוֹמֵר עַד הָאֵל הַקָּדוֹשׁ בְּקוֹל, וְאוֹמְרִים קְדֻשָּׁה וְגוֹמֵר תְּפִלָּתוֹ בְּלַחַשׁ. (ס"ט). So you definitely need six, I'm still trying to find a source for 10 people being there when they start the silent one – aBochur Jan 26 '18 at 0:25
  • Again - I think the kitzur is referring to if you had a minyan of people but not all were davening, 6 is the minimum requirement that are davening together. Again - not this question. – Draizy-Levi Pine Jan 26 '18 at 0:28
  • A belated welcome to Mi Yodeya, Draizy. This is a practical question for me as my shul has this situation, frequently. FYI, even though I thought this was "silly", my shul wants a chazzan to be on the bimah even when there's no minyan. (What's the point of a shaliach tzibur when there's no tzibur, right?) But the rabbi stated his reasoning was that if a tzibur does show up, someone is ready to go, and that avoids tircha detzibur when we DO get one! – DanF Jan 26 '18 at 14:50
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Refer to O.C. 69:1. The starting rule is that there were a group of people that didn't hear Kedusha (among other items, irrelevant to your question). It says that one person says Avot, Gevurot and Kedusha assuming that there are now at least 10 people (which is your case.) See the remainder of the paragraph that elaborates that even though you now have 10, at least 6 of them should not have heard Kedusha, previously (I guess this prevents extras that come in to form the minyan but had heard it in a different minyan?)

Also refer to Mishna Berurah commentaries 8 and 9 which elaborate further and offer other opinions.

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  • I see that this Q has been bumped. If this answer is insufficient, please suggest what else you may be seeking. – DanF Mar 27 '18 at 17:11

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