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A husband cannot make his wife do something using a vow (Helckas Mehokek 74.17 end, Bais Shmuel 74.12 end).

אם מדיר אותה דבר שהוא לטובתה כגון שהדיר קונם הנאת תשמישך עלי אם לא תתקשט והיא אינה רוצה א"י לכופה והנדר חל והוא אין לו דין מורד והיא אינה מורדת ולאחר ששה חדשים יוצי' ויתן הכתובה כמ"ש בסי' ע"ז:

The Shach writes (235.16) that if she was the one who made a vow, he can force her to do things by annulling the vow on condition that she does them, as long as they are not degrading.


But theoretically can a husband forbid his wife from doing something (that does not hurt her)?

For example if he tells her "relations with you are forbidden to me if you go to your parents house during this next week" (halachikly it only hurts her to not go to her parents for more than a month - if they live in the same city).

Is she allowed to go to her parents house (during this week)?
What happens if she does?
Does it make her a moredes?

PS. How about not theoretically?

Sources please

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    I remember that the gemara does deal with this but will have to find it. – sabbahillel Nov 16 '17 at 0:14
  • @sabbahillel i guess to start here sefaria.org/Ketubot.70a.7 – hazoriz Nov 16 '17 at 0:25
  • As I recall, it is a discussion if a person says his wife is forbidden if she visits her father before succos and the discussion concerns exactly what is involved and when it takes effect. It might also be in the Rambam. – sabbahillel Nov 16 '17 at 1:06
  • @sabbahillel rambam halacha 12 here chabad.org/952887 (ishut 13) – hazoriz Nov 16 '17 at 1:08
  • I think that it would be in masechet nedarim as well involving a conditional neder. If he makes a neder if she goes to her father before succos, what is done until succos. – sabbahillel Nov 16 '17 at 1:46
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I am merely translating the passage quoted by the questioner from the Chelkas Mechokek Shulchan Aruch even hoezer 74,17 which gives us the answers:

אם מדיר אותה דבר שהוא לטובתה כגון שהדיר קונם הנאת תשמישך עלי אם לא תתקשט והיא אינה רוצה א"י לכופה והנדר חל והוא אין לו דין מורד והיא אינה מורדת ולאחר ששה חדשים יוצי' ויתן הכתובה כמ"ש בסי' ע"ז:

If the Husband makes a stipulation that leads to a neder forbidding himself from relations with his wife, even if that stipulation is for her own benefit e.g., "if you don't apply make up (which women generally want to do), then your relations are forbidden to me" - he cannot force her to comply, so if she doesn't apply make up the neder is triggered i.e she is now forbidden for relations to him. He is not a Mored (which would incur a forced divorce straight away and payment of kesuba if husband is mored by making a Neder she cannot live with) and She is not a moredes (which would incur a forced divorce straight away without the payment of the kesuba). So we wait 6 months which is the maximum wait for relations for a woman (e.g if her husband is a sailor) and he should then divorce her with a Kesuba unless she wants to remain married despite being forbidden to her husband as prescribed in Shulchan Aruch Even Haezer 77.

So we see that if she transgresses her husband's stipulation even against her own benefit (e.g., not put make up on), that triggers her husbands neder to forbid her relations. This is in spite of the husband making a positve stipulation that he may think is for her own good.
Stipulating to not let her see her parents for a week while it might not affect her for just 1 week (which is why the husband is not a Mored), is a negative stipulation that encroaches on her freedom. If she can transgress a positive stipulation, how much more so should she be allowed to transgress a negative stipulation to go and see them if she wants to, thus forbiding relations with her husband, remaining married for the next 6 months leading to divorce with kesuba and she is not a Moredes.

Conclusion: A husband that Dominates his wife's normal freedom that the Torah allows, by making stipulations leading to nedarim to disallow her to do something, cannot force the wife to comply.
If she does not keep the stipulation even though the Husband's neder now works that she can no longer have relations with him (if she has relations she transgresses lo yachel devaro), her choice to not keep the tenai (stipulation), enables her to receive a forced divorce after 6 months no relations, and she gets her full kesuba.

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    +1 thanks for you work, can you please prove or provide evidence that your statement "If she can transgress a positive stipulation, how much more so should she be allowed to transgress a negative stipulation to go and see them if she wants to" is true, to me it seems possible that the reason she is not a Moredes is because she was passive and did not actively do something, but if she actively "transgress a negative stipulation" she might be a moredes, please prove my logic wrong – hazoriz Dec 14 '17 at 23:34
  • Is my understanding of the shach quoted in the OP wrong? – hazoriz Dec 14 '17 at 23:36
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    Passivity can be penalized as well as active transgression with regards to moredes.We see that if she refuses relations to her husband for 4 weeks he can divorce her without a Kesuba even though she is not doing anything see kesubos 63b and SA EH 77,2. So the fundemental point of the Chelkas Mechokek is that even "לטובתה"- for her benefit she can transgress his tenai, because of limiting her freedom, and how much more so when he limits her freedom for no reason. – user15464 Dec 15 '17 at 1:27
  • As with regards to the shach you are right that since it is she making the vow, it is not unreasonable for him to annul her vow on condition she does something that is not demeaning because without his Haphara she would be much worst off stuck with her Neder. But if he makes a neder with a stipulation against her he can't force her to comply at all. – user15464 Dec 15 '17 at 1:30
  • it is possible that the stipulation was for her to not do something for her own good (the vow will take affect if she does something bad for her) – hazoriz Dec 15 '17 at 1:43

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