Is it allowed to buy and give some drink or food for the girl during the dating process?

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    Is there any intent that this food should serve as Kiddushin? Are there any witnesses?
    – Double AA
    Commented Aug 23, 2017 at 22:19
  • Is the man saying as he gives her the food and drink, harei at mekudeshes li? Commented Aug 23, 2017 at 23:18
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    @sabbahillel One can certainly get married without saying that, see judaism.stackexchange.com/a/78535/8775.
    – mevaqesh
    Commented Aug 24, 2017 at 0:19
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    The possibility for such things renders your first comment basically irrelevant. It is the latter which is. @sab
    – mevaqesh
    Commented Aug 24, 2017 at 3:02
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    @Laser123 Hmm... So maybe the waiter married the girl. Probably a good reason to end the date.
    – Loewian
    Commented Aug 24, 2017 at 3:14

1 Answer 1


The short answer is yes, it's permissible. Just don't say it's for the sake of kiddushin. I think we could reasonably agree on a devarim shebelev kol adam level that the average fellow paying for his date's dinner does not intend that they be married right now!

What you're probably thinking of (or if some rabbi said it, his source most likely) is the Shulchan Aruch advising against getting in the habit of single guys sending a single girls Mishloach Manos, "as that could lead to safek kiddushin. The commentaries there struggle with how that could come about; Rabbi Hershel Schachter acknowledges it's unlikely from a halachic perspective ... "but that's the chumra." Personally (though I'm not sure if this is really the Shulchan Aruch's language) I think it makes a lot of sense on Purim -- it's a day when people are often tipsy, uninhibited, feel that all sorts of things are allowed that normally wouldn't be, so if a lot of single guys are sending single women Mishloach Manos, it's likely sooner or later that one of them will declare harei at, and perhaps even in front of witnesses -- maybe just in jest ... but still ...

  • How do you know R. Schachter said this? Where does the ShA say this? What is "devarim shebelev kol adam", and how do you know it applies here? Sources?
    – mevaqesh
    Commented Aug 24, 2017 at 0:22
  • @mevaqesh if someone knows enough to use the term "sofek kiddushin", I assume a reasonably high background. A.) YUTorah mp3, I think it's "inyanei Purim." B.) In Hilchos Megillah, talking about Mishloach Manos. C.) Things that [almost] all people take for granted without saying.
    – Shalom
    Commented Aug 24, 2017 at 0:29
  • There have been cases of teenagers joking around and a boy has a "mock wedding" giving a girl a cracker jack box ring and saying it. Caused all sorts of trouble and they almost had to write a get which would have made her pasul to marry a kohen. Commented Aug 24, 2017 at 0:47

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