0

In Shulchan Aruch Yoreh Deah Siman 118 Sif 1 it says that wine, meat, and pieces fish (where the signs of the fish are no longer recognizable) that are sent using a non-Jew needs to have "shtei chosamos" (2 seals.)

I saw the claim recently that gefilte fish in a jar fulfills this requirement of having 2 seals because of 1) the printed label has the reliable markings of a kashrus organization and 2) the fact that when you open the the jar for the "first time" you hear a "click" when opening it because of the vacuum seal.

My questions are as follows:

1) How could a printed label with the markings of a kashrus organization be a valid "seal"? Anyway nowadays could get a glass jar (whether it be a different one or the one normally used for the gefilte fish) and print a label on it with the relevant markings of the kashrus organization (along with any other branding, ingredients, other details, etc?)

2) How can the fact that you hear a "click" when opening the jar showing that it is vacuumed sealed be considered a proper "chosem" (seal?) Whether it be going out and buying my own jar, giving it a label and then closing it and using a vacuum sealer bought online (for only $9.99!), it would be fairly easy to do this? Someone could even take the regular jar with the original label, empty it out, put in the non-kosher gelfite fish and then seal it with a cheap vacuum sealer in ones own home.

How are these 2 things realiable chosemes for gefilte fish sold in a jar? (I'm speaking about a case where even though it's being sold in a Jewish store and the company that (is being claimed to have) made it might be Jewish, but the transporter (let's say) isn't Jewish.)

  • Ironic how you say how easy it could be to fake the seals, yet you describe a very pretty heavy and invested process to accomplish the fakery – Shoel U'Meishiv May 19 '17 at 12:19
  • @ShoelU'Meishiv "heavy and invested" ... like that what? Going and printing stickered labels plus buying a $10 vacuum isn't so hard! If it's possible for me to do then why should it be a good seal??? – Yehoshua May 19 '17 at 12:20
  • Rav Moshe has a tshuva about this, where I think he says even one seal is ok as long as the seal is something that is even minorly difficult to re-produce (something that vacuum seal could fit into). – Shoel U'Meishiv May 19 '17 at 12:22
  • 2
    Technically anything is feasibly re-produced right? A printer, a scanner, could re-produce Jewish writings. The question is though, is the goy going to go to the lengths to do this trickery? Re: the rav Moshe, try looking at Yoreh Deah 1:54, I think it's located there. I don't have a Iggros Moshe with me right now – Shoel U'Meishiv May 19 '17 at 12:29
  • 1
    I think there may be a difference on a raw piece of fish and a cooked piece of Gefilte. Gefilte is inherently a Jewish type of food. I am not aware of a non Jewish product that looks like it and would be mistaken for it. – Gershon Gold May 21 '17 at 14:00

You must log in to answer this question.

Browse other questions tagged .