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I read in Sefer Hachinuch mitzva 338 that a Jew is obligated to not be as a stone when he is getting degraded.

But does this still stand by a parent whom you have to respect?

What should you do if you are being scolded? Should you give an excuse, give an argument that you are not so bad, not comment, smile (some people get upset if you do not get upset from their scolding), or something else?

What with the subtext of a discussion with parents, arguing is also an affective joke between members of a family? The open content and the hidden content are different. If you are Tsadik Harbe, you may be indifferent as a stranger and cold, not interested by contact, by discussion. Sometimes scolding is a proof of love.

marked as duplicate by Shokhet, sabbahillel, mevaqesh, Gershon Gold halacha Jul 3 '16 at 3:26

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  • 2
    aish.com/f/rf/65928937.html – rosends Jul 1 '16 at 2:51
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    Duplicate of judaism.stackexchange.com/q/67746, perhaps. – msh210 Jul 1 '16 at 3:51
  • @msh210 I think so; the only difference I can see is the mention of Sefer Hachinuch. I cast the first vote; let's see if this question gets closed (and if it does, I recomment a merge, given that this question has already been answered) – Shokhet Jul 1 '16 at 9:01
  • @Shokhet "smile (some people get upset if you do not get upset from their scolding), " Is it in the OP, this question is different because it introduces the notion of subtext in arguing, – kouty Jul 1 '16 at 13:58
  • @Shokhet this question is really different, it contains an allusion to the subtext of a discussion with parents, arguing is also an affective jocke between members of a family. The open content and the hidden content are different. If you are Tsadik Harbe, you may be indifferent and cold, not interested by contact. – kouty Jul 1 '16 at 14:02

Good question, with some degree of subtlety.

See Shulchan Aruch Yore Dea 240, 3:

ג עַד הֵיכָן מוֹרָאָם, הָיָה הַבֵּן לָבוּשׁ חֲמוּדוֹת וְיוֹשֵׁב בְּרֹאשׁ הַקָּהָל, וּבָאוּ אָבִיו וְאִמּוֹ וְקָרְעוּ (ה) בְּגָדָיו וְהִכּוּהוּ עַל רֹאשׁוֹ וְיָרְקוּ בְּפָנָיו, לֹא יַכְלִים אוֹתָם, אֶלָּא יִשְׁתֹּק, וְיִירָא מִן מֶּלֶךְ מַלְכֵי הַמְּלָכִים שֶׁצִּוָּהוּ בְּכָךְ.

באר היטב (ה) בגדיו. מיהו מותר לתבעו בדין כדלקמן ס''ח בהג''ה. ש''ך:

How far will we go with the commandment to be afraid of parents? For example: He was very well dressed and seat at the head table, his father or his mother come, tearing up his clothes, assaulting him and spit in his face. He can not demean them, but need to remain silent, and to be afraid of the king of kings of kings, which ordered him.
He can however claim damages.


The Gemara gives an example of incestuous mother, of a main Amora, he simply run away (Kiddushin 31b):

רב אסי הוה ליה ההיא אמא זקינה אמרה לי' בעינא תכשיטין עבד לה בעינא גברא נייעין לך בעינא גברא דשפיר כותך שבקה ואזל לארעא דישראל שמע דקא אזלה אבתריה אתא לקמיה דרבי יוחנן אמר לי' מהו לצאת מארץ לחוצה לארץ א''ל אסור לקראת אמא מהו א''ל איני יודע [אתרח] פורתא הדר אתא אמר ליה אסי נתרצית לצאת המקום יחזירך לשלום אתא לקמיה דרבי אלעזר א''ל חס ושלום דלמא מירתח רתח א''ל מאי אמר לך אמר ליה המקום יחזירך לשלום אמר ליה ואם איתא דרתח לא הוה מברך לך אדהכי והכי שמע לארונא דקאתי ‏

R' Assi had an aged mother. Said she to him, 'I want ornaments.' So he made them for her.' I want a husband.' - 'I will look out for you.' I want a husband as handsome as you.' {Hagahot Hagra in name of Rambam Shoftim Mamrim, 6, 10, said that she was mentally ill, see in link Raavad and Kesef Mishne}, i.e. that she wanted to marry him Thereupon he left her and went to Palestine. On hearing that she was following him he went to R' Johanan and asked him, 'May I leave Palestine for abroad? ' 'It is forbidden, he replied.' But what if it is to meet my mother? ' 'I do not know', said he. He waited a short time and went before him again.' Assi', said he, 'you have determined to go; [may] the Omnipresent bring you back in peace.' Then he went before R' Eleazar and said to him, 'Perhaps, God forbid, he was angry? ' 'What [then] did he say to you? ' enquired he.' The Omnipresent bring you back in peace', was the answer.' Had he been angry', he rejoined, 'he would not have blessed you'. In the meanwhile he learnt that her coffin was coming.

This Gemara is also ruled in Shulchan Aruch later sayif 10

But the question has a point of subtlety.

If parents like as a joke to teasing their son, and a part of the joke is respondent, obviously it is permitted because the son makes the will of his parents when he participate to the joke, as a ping-pong game. Arguing is sometimes a way to touch one another for loved persons. The son must to understand this and demonstrate creativity in halachic congruent humain relationship. If the son is perfect, his message is "You can no more touch me, I am no more at your level!"

I just see that @msh210 gives a link with an answer which contains almost all my answer from @Danny Shoenman

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