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Are there Halachic sources regarding the expulsion of a "nuisance student"? Or Halachic sources of not expelling a "nuisance student"? (Is this issue ever addressed as a real halachic issue?)

Below are some examples of what I mean by a nuisance

1) an actual disturbance in class

2) a student who doesn't take school seriously

3) a bad influence

4) a student suffering from a Mental disorder which interferes with school

  • Welcome to Mi Yodeya! Do you have a reason to assume that halacha deals with a "nuisance student"? Feel free to edit that in. – Scimonster Oct 26 '14 at 13:18
  • It seems an important value that they should be educated by a school. – andrewmh20 Oct 26 '14 at 13:30
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    I don't have time to summarize the opinions myself, but someone who has more time should see Tzitz Eliezer, 8:15; Yabiah Omer Yoreh Deah 2:17; Iggeros Moshe Yoreh Deah, 3:71 (about non-Jewish students), and R. Hershel Schachter's article in RJJ Journal vol 12 – הנער הזה Oct 26 '14 at 16:49
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    and this article: traditionarchive.org/news/_pdfs/Pollack-Schnall.1.pdf – הנער הזה Oct 26 '14 at 16:51
  • Not sure if this was mentioned anywhere, but the Malochim offshoot of Chabad supposedly distinguish themselves by not expelling anyone – SAH Mar 16 '15 at 15:06
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This is indeed a serious issue and has been discussed by many rabbonim. There have been a number of articles on this. Here are a few.

Jerusalem - R’ Ovadia Yosef: It Is Forbidden To Expel Children From Yeshiva

Rav Ovadiah Yosef explains how he was able to actually turn a boy around before he was expelled.

Parshat Vayetzei Vol.10 No.12 Expelling Students From a Yeshiva by Reuven Rosen

Conclusion
It appears that the guidelines for schools should be as follows:

1) One should only accept students with good character or questionable character to schools. Students with bad character should not be accepted with the expectation that they will turn around. Weaker students, though, should not be rejected from schools if they have good character.

2) If a student makes trouble, suspend him from class and actively work on his character. Allow him back into class when he is ready.

3) If the child continues to make trouble, decide whether he is influencing others.

a) If he is influencing others, put him into a special class or school for behaviorally challenged students.

b) If he is not influencing others, decide whether it will be more advantageous to keep him in a regular class or put him in a special class for challenged students.

4) If the student continues to make trouble in the special class, remove him, but think long and hard before doing so because it is Dinei Nefashot, a question of the [spiritual] life and death of the student and those whom he affects negatively.

No Child Can be Left Behind

Responsible Chinuch By Rabbi Yaacov Haber

The CI on Expelling Students from Yeshiva

Yitzchok Levine

May 14, 2012 03:15AM

The latest volume (13) of Hakirah, The Flatbush Journal of Jewish Law and Thought has a number of articles that I consider well worth reading. See (www.hakirah.org) This page says "It is our policy to put the full text of the articles onto our web site only after the next issue becomes available. Only the first two pages of the articles in this, the current issue, are available for viewing." Thus, most of the articles in volume 13 are not yet online. However, the price of this journal is only $10 including shipping for those who live in the US so one can readily order it. See [www.hakirah.org]

Unfortunately, at the moment only the first two pages of the article "Should School Children of Varying Levels of Observance be Segregated?" - by Aharon Hirsch Fried is online. The following is from the article:

NOTE The link provided now has the entire article

<<

The Chazon Ish, ztz"l, was strongly against any student being expelled from a cheder or yeshiva and often insisted that children who did not seem to fit the mold be accepted into strong yeshivot. On one occasion when a bochur was expelled from a yeshiva, he reacted with the following: 16

I don't understand, he said. Have you ever heard a hospital to expel a patient because he is too ill?! If he is ill, he belongs in the hospital!

A yeshiva expels a boy because he is not as he should be. Well if he is not as he should be, where should he be if not in the yeshiva?

But the answer is that the individual does not interest them. All that matters is that their enterprise (i.e., organization, yeshiva, cheder, school and the like) continue to function.

16 I heard this from Rav Aryeh Weinberg, shlit"a of Jerusalem to whom the Chazon Ish said this. It has since been published in the 4th volume of the sefer Maaseh Ish by Zvi Yabrov, Bnei Brak 5761, p. 46

Sadly, there are children who are expelled from the more right wing yeshivas, and their parents find themselves with no alternative for their education. IMO, in these cases the last statement of the Chazon Ish, "But the answer is that the individual does not interest them. All that matters is that their enterprise (i.e., organization, yeshiva, cheder, school and the like) continue to function." is far too often on the mark.

Professor Yitzchok Levine
Department of Mathematical Sciences Stevens Institute of Technology Hoboken, NJ 07030 llevine@stevens.edu [personal.stevens.edu]

Teaching Students, Not Subjects

According to “Chadrei Chareidim” (www.bhol.co.il), the Rav pleaded with the educators to keep in mind two thoughts as the new school year begins. One, to continually relate to each and every student as a neshama, a pure and precious soul. Two, to stop expelling students from yeshivas.

Parashat Noah- Noah’s Ark and the Yeshiva

Hence, unlike in generations past, Yeshivah education is not an option, but a vital necessity. We cannot imagine Noah trying to survive the flood outside the Teba. By the same token, it is impossible to expect impressionable young souls to survive the “flood” of immorality and decadence that has overtaken the world in our time if they remain outside the insular, protective framework of the Yeshiva.

This is a vital message for not only parents, but also educators. The Hazon Ish (Rav Avraham Yeshaya Karelitz, 1878-1953) cautioned that in our times, the decision to expel a student from Yeshiva requires a 23-member Bet Din. According to Halacha, life-and-death cases cannot be brought before a standard, three-member court; they require the adjudication of 23 expert judges. In our day and age, the Hazon Ish said, expelling a student is a matter of spiritual life and death. This is not a decision that may be made on a whim.

Unfortunately, many schools today are so caught up with preserving their reputations that they forget this vital message. Administrators must understand that in our society, where an expelled student could end up in a street or in public school, expulsion can very well become a spiritual death sentence. Such decisions must be made with the utmost caution and discretion, and with a keen awareness of the vital protective role that today’s Yeshivot fill.

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    Is this issue treated seriously on paper and then differently in reality? – Just Curious Oct 29 '14 at 16:14
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HaRav Eliyahu Mansour just touched on this topic in his derashah on Parashat Noahh 5775 (link):

The Hazon Ish (Rav Avraham Yeshaya Karelitz, 1878-1953) cautioned that in our times, the decision to expel a student from Yeshiva requires a 23-member Bet Din. According to Halacha, life-and-death cases cannot be brought before a standard, three-member court; they require the adjudication of 23 expert judges. In our day and age, the Hazon Ish said, expelling a student is a matter of spiritual life and death. This is not a decision that may be made on a whim.

Unfortunately, many schools today are so caught up with preserving their reputations that they forget this vital message. Administrators must understand that in our society, where an expelled student could end up in a street or in public school, expulsion can very well become a spiritual death sentence. Such decisions must be made with the utmost caution and discretion, and with a keen awareness of the vital protective role that today’s Yeshivot fill.

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    Wouldn't it need 23-members with real semikha? So accd to this no one can ever expel a student ever until Mashiach comes. – Double AA Oct 26 '14 at 14:15
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    As HaRav Mansour's closing remark conveys, I think the underlying message is that such a decision "be made with the utmost caution and discretion" and not that expulsion from school is equivalent to execution. – Lee Oct 26 '14 at 14:18
  • The gemara has a beef with reb Yehoshua ben Prachya for chucking yeishu hanotzri. And the gemara allows a rebbi to be fired without warning when he is deemed unsuitable. So in both respects we are living in an upside down world. – user6591 Oct 26 '14 at 14:24
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R. Moshe Feinstein ruled in a responsum (Igros Moshe Yoreh Deiah 3:71) that a student who is a bad influence on the other students must be removed; however the case must be very carefully judged, as this is considered like a "life and death" issue.

אבל אם התלמיד מקלקל את אחרים ודאי צריך לסלקו אבל צריך לדון זה בכובד ראש ובעיון רב כי הוא כדיני נפשות

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