In the Minhag Rheinus, we have piyutim which are added by ma'ariv and shacharit on yom tov, as well as on certain Shabbatot. While I am aware of the position of some of them (Yotzer, Ofan, Zulat, kerovot) I am unaware of the actual position certain of the others, namely the ones by Ma'ariv and the Ahavah (the only fromm schul in my area being a Chabad). Is there a chart anywhere which lists the positions of the remaining piyutim?

  • By "position", do you mean to ask precisely where within the b'racha it's inserted?
    – msh210
    Commented Jul 14, 2014 at 6:29
  • Which siddurim/machzorim have you checked? Which piyutim do you mean? Anything that can be checked in the Rudelheim or Goldschmidt? Commented Jul 14, 2014 at 11:47
  • @msh210, yes, for example, should an ahavah go before or after baruch yotzer hameorot; if before between which pasukim Commented Jul 14, 2014 at 13:27
  • @Matt, I own only two of the 5 volumes of shalosh regalim machzorim, a Rödelheim for Shmini Atzeret/Simchat Torah, and a Sulzbach for Shavuot. Due to their advanced ages (over 140 years) and low-quality paper, I am always uncomfortable leafing through them. Commented Jul 14, 2014 at 13:30

1 Answer 1


In Ashkenaz today [the situation was different in different communities in the past]:

  • Me'ora - Before or chodosh.
  • Ahava - different minhogim, either before v'keiravtanu or before l'hodos lecho.
  • Maarivim
    • Short piyut before end of first berocho,
    • Same with second;
      • long piyut before בגילה ברינה בשמחה רבה ואמרו כלם,
      • short piyut before זה צור ישענו פצו פה ואמרו [insted of זה א-לי ענו ואמרו],
    • short piyut before end of that berocho,
    • and short or long piyut before the end of השכיבנו.
  • 1
    Welcome to Mi Yodeya! The question was asking for the existence of a chart. Also, in general, providing sources improves the value of answers here, since I'm sure you're great but none of us know you. Commented Aug 19, 2014 at 22:17
  • They are called Ma'arovos. Also, who puts an Ahavoh before l'hodos lecho? Commented Sep 11, 2014 at 17:50
  • 1
    @JoshuaPearl The Rodelheim that was printed about 15 years ago has piyutim in the back. The instructions clearly indicate that the ahavoh for the week before shavu'oth and 9 Av (the only ahavoh in the German nusach) is inserted at this point. I am a member of KAJ in Washington Heights, and that is what we do as well. Commented Dec 26, 2014 at 15:26
  • @JosephK.Strauss, do you have a link to where I could get this Rödelheim. PS. Do you know places to stay near Breuer's if one is in town for a schabbos? Commented Mar 18, 2015 at 18:32
  • @JosephK.Strauss You are correct. I have recently seen this verion of the Avodas Yisroel. Commented May 26, 2015 at 10:46

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