I happened to observe a Facebook conversation regarding an upcoming Siyum, ostensibly taking place because someone had put forth great effort to complete a tractate of Talmud, and not because the organizers wanted to eat meat during the Nine Days. The question was asked whether meat would be served, and someone said, "If there's no Hadran there's no meat."

  • Is that correct? That is, does eating meat at a Siyum during the Nine Days require a Hadran?

Furthermore, I wonder:

  • Does Hadran require a minyan (the Siyum-maker apparently assumed so, and was not planning to say the Hadran)? Does the presence of a Minyan obligate a Hadran?
  • Does the presence of a Minyan (with or without a Hadran) obligate a Kaddish?
  • Do Kaddish and Hadran obligate one another (ie., do you need to do both)?
  • And what if there's no Minyan available? Can meat be eaten at such a Siyum during the Nine Days anyway? Can someone make a Siyum with (or even without) a friend or two and then eat meat as part of a Se'udath Mitzvah?
  • I suspect the answer to all your questions is no.
    – Double AA
    Jul 10, 2013 at 5:40
  • 2
    the custom in Belz is to never say the Hadran and never say Kaddish after a siyum mesechet - year round. I do not know the reason or source.
    – eramm
    Jul 10, 2013 at 10:03
  • 2
    halachafortodaycom.blogspot.com/2012/04/q-page-13.html scroll down to question 617
    – rosends
    Jul 10, 2013 at 11:58
  • 2
    how can you have any hadran if you don't eat your meat? Sep 7, 2014 at 20:38
  • 1
    @Clint Eastwood +1
    – user6591
    Sep 8, 2014 at 23:38

2 Answers 2


R' Yaakov Shechter maintains that while it is very nice to have a minyan, it is not a necessity, and a Siyum is considered a 'Sedudas Mitzva' irrespective as to how many are present.

כל ענין המניין הוא רק לחבב המצוה ולעשות את הסעודה לגומרה של תורה ברוב עם, אבל השמחה היא בעצם הסיום וראוי לערוך על כך סעודה גם בינו לבין עצמו ודינה כסעודת מצוה לכל דבר וענין. בדיוק כמו סעודת שבת וחג שאדם אוכלה לבדו, אין היא פחות סעודת מצוה מאדם שזוכה לאכול את סעודות השבת ברוב עם.

The poskim do say that one may only make a siyum during the 9 Days on finishing something 'proper' - i.e. something that would require a Gadran. Sorry no sources off hand..


In the back of each Artscroll volume of the Talmud, the Hadran is prefaced by the following:

Upon the completion of the study of an entire tractate, a festive meal...should be eaten - preferably with a minyan in attendance. The following prayers of thanksgiving are recited by those who have completed the learning.

The implication is that that a minyan is not required for the Hadran.

Kaddish can not be recited without a minyan. (ibid.)

The book Guidelines for Pesach says that, in order to permit a firstborn to break his fast on Erev Pesach, the siyum must be on one of the following:

  1. A tractate of Gemarah
  2. An order of Mishnah
  3. Any of the 24 books of Tanach, when studied in depth
  4. Any of the four sections of Shulchan Aruch

Presumably, the same would apply to eating meat on the nine days. Hence, it is possible to have a qualifying siyum without having a Hadran (since the Hadran is not said on a book of Tanach or section of Shulchan Orech, as far as I know).

  • 2
    I have heard Hadran said on Tanakh
    – Double AA
    May 9, 2014 at 19:53
  • The Guidlines book for the 3 Weeks does indeed say the same thing. Jan 3, 2020 at 15:21
  • I have actually had a p'sak to make a siyum on finishing Hilchos Tzitzis in the Shulchan Aruch (months of work for me). I'm wondering what the source is for the p'sak that you need to finish a whole chelek of Shulchan Aruch; that seems like a huge amount, more than a regular masechta, for instance. And isn't there an incident that R' Moshe Feinstein z"l said to make a siyum on one blatt of gemara, if it involved a lot of work for the person involved?
    – MichoelR
    Jul 16, 2021 at 0:44

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