Clarification : Mr. X is a orthodox religious Jew. Mr. X has a rebellious phase and violates shaboss. Mr. X later starts keeping the rules again. I'm asking in both cases:

Case 1: Ten people knew about it.

Case 2: Fewer than 10 people knew.

I'm asking specifically in regards to yayin nesech. If a person was known to not be shomer shaboss (i.e. not frum) and he (or she) then becomes shomer shaboss, when would one be allowed to drink non-mevushal wine with them?

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    shachna, welcome to Mi Yodeya, and thanks for the interesting question. I hope you stick around and enjoy the site. Editing in to your question a source for your implied claim that sh'miras Shabas is what is determinative of whether someone makes wine yayin nesech would boost your question's quality.
    – msh210
    Jun 22, 2012 at 0:14
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    Also please note that there is a difference between Yayin Nesech and Stam Yeynam.
    – Seth J
    Jun 22, 2012 at 0:40
  • Just to point out that this question is only according to those who prohibit uncooked wine touched by non-Sabbath observers.
    – Double AA
    Jun 22, 2012 at 0:45
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    After s/he becomes shomer shaboss...whenever they want!
    – Double AA
    Jun 22, 2012 at 0:48
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    @ba That's in Hilchot Shechita and since we know it doesn't apply in its entirety (ie he doesn't need to convert, his kiddushin is probably kiddushin, he is likely zokek for yibbum etc.) there is great reason to think that the Shulchan Aruch is only referring to his status as a non-Jew vis-a-vis that his Shechita is Neveila. It is not at all clear that he would extend this rule to wine, especially since he doesn't repeat the rule by wine. So no, not everyone agrees.
    – Double AA
    Jun 22, 2012 at 3:48

1 Answer 1


The Shulchan Aruch in Yoreh Deah 124:8 says that a yisrael mumar traifs up the wine when he touches it, but he's considered trustworthy when he says he's done teshuvah.

  • See the Shach and Gra who limit that ruling to where no one knew he had sinned. If it was known that he sinned, he needs to bring proof that he did teshuva.
    – Double AA
    Jul 1, 2012 at 23:29

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