If you were writing pointed text with a pe lefufah (or doubled/spiral pe, or pe kefulah) for pedagogical purposes, and the pe had a dagesh, would you write the dagesh inside the inner spiral, or inside the outer spiral but outside the inner one?

  • 1
    Any reason to think there's an official answer here? Seems to be Primarily Opinion Based
    – Double AA
    Aug 3, 2022 at 0:34
  • It just seems like a thing that must have come up before. I would settle for an example of someone marking it some way in a text, even if there isn’t an official answer.
    – sideband
    Aug 3, 2022 at 3:04

2 Answers 2


I was beginning to despair, but found examples from תורה קדומה, a Teimani chumash.


Both Exodus 23:6 (marked with only ו) and 23:13 (marked יג) on the page contain examples of pe lefufah with a dagesh, and place it inside the outer spiral but outside the inner one.

  • Not relevant to the question, but I'm curious about where you found the page in your link. Which website can I find it on? How do I access other pages? Mar 12 at 1:24

Since the spiral is an alternative form of the upside-down Yod head, the daggesh should go in the same place as usual: In the larger space, outside of the inner spiral, but within the larger spiral.

Of course, there's no obligation to write it this way; it's just standard. If you want to write it in the inner spiral, nobody will stop you.

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