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If one is lighting Chanukah candles inside (for whatever reason) relying on the publicizing to himself and his family, then what should he do on Friday night if he is eating out? Must he make the candles long enough to see for half an hour when he comes back, or is half an hour after nightfall enough?

(He shouldn't light at the host's house, since lighting where you won't be sleeping doesn't fulfill the obligation.)

In terms of Shabbat candles, I was always told to either light at the host or light long enough candles to see when I return. Is this Halacha parallel?

  • It's interesting that the Mishna B'rura and Beur Halacha discuss similar cases but not this one. I wonder whether eating at another's house on Friday night, but not sleeping there, was uncommon in his day. – msh210 Dec 20 '11 at 1:40
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    @DoubleAA | Practical answer: If possible, go home after davening, and hang out with the candles for a few minutes before going out to eat. – Shmuel Dec 20 '11 at 2:40
  • @ShmuelL I asked my LOR this year and he gave your answer. – Avrohom Yitzchok Nov 27 '13 at 21:07
  • yeshiva.co/midrash/shiur.asp?id=9364 . But really, that parenthetical paragraph should be sourced and you could make it clearer whether or not you want answers that respect that assumption or are willing to take answers that refute it. – Yishai Dec 21 '14 at 5:05
  • @Yishai I didn't add it... – Double AA Dec 21 '14 at 5:05
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No, they are not parallel in this regard that chanuka candles do not need to stay on for half an hour after they return(see Yalkut Yosef 672:11, below).

יא בן המתארח אצל אביו בשבת חנוכה, ויוצא מביתו ביום ששי אחר פלג המנחה כדי ללכת לאביו, ועתיד לחזור לביתו בלילה, יש אומרים שידליק בביתו אחר פלג המנחה, באופן שהנרות ידלקו עד אחר חצי שעה מצאת הכוכבים, שמאחר וחוזר לישן בביתו, החיוב הוא על הבית. ובן חתן שנושא אשה בלילה, כיון שבשעת ההדלקה היה עדיין רווק וסמוך על שלחן אביו, יוצא ידי חובה בהדלקת הנרות של אביו. ואם ירצה טוב שיחמיר להדליק נר חנוכה בלא ברכה כשמגיע לביתו אחר החתונה

Chanuka candles are for the purpose of pirsumei nisa(not for shlom bayit or benefiting from their light; which is actually forbidden! See Yalkut Yosef siman א chanuka in the section אסור להשתמש לאורה) and that purpose is fulfilled when done with his family in the home(so long as it remains lit at least 30 minutes after nightfall; ibid).

Shabbat candles serve the purpose of benefiting the home by providing light for oneg shabbat(Shulchan Aruch OC 263:2; Rashi & Tosfot on Shabbat 25b{כבוד שבת and במקום סעודה ibid.}) and shlom bayit(Shulchan Aruch OC 263:3) and since that is their purpose, one must actually benefit from the light and ensure that they stay lit some time after they return from their meal(see SA OC 263:9 and the Mishna Berura ibid).

In this case, one may light the chanuka candles in their home before shabbat(but after plag) with candles that will last for at least 30 minutes after nightfall and light shabbat candles with ones that will stay lit for at least some time after their estimated return according the sources cited above. Or, they may return home for a few minutes after praying the shabbat evening services, as suggested in the comments above(Shmuel).

Written with assistance by the sefer Emet L'Ya'akov by R' Ya'akov Peretz shlita.

  • I don't understand. Who sees the candles at night before he gets home that there is any Prisumei Nisa at all? – Double AA Sep 16 '18 at 1:15
  • @DoubleAA From what I remember, the mitvzah is lighting at the valid time; which is why even someone who lives alone where no other Jews live can light on his dining table and still fulfill the mitzvah. I agree that it's a mitzvah for more people to see it and to increase awareness of the miracle; but we don't necessarily see it being me'a'kev the mitzvah, practically speaking. If you like, I can look for a more definitive answer among the sefarim closely available to me. – chacham Nisan Sep 16 '18 at 17:48
  • You're right that you can light just for yourself, but here you won't be seeing it at night. That's the important point here and you haven't addressed it. – Double AA Sep 16 '18 at 18:01
  • It seems like it's not a requirement; just that it lasts enough time(not like nerot shabbat). – chacham Nisan Sep 16 '18 at 18:03
  • Why does it seem that way to you? It doesn't seem like that to me – Double AA Sep 16 '18 at 18:03
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Smeone who is going away early, יוצא לדרך may light The Chanukah candles any night of Chanukah from Plag Hamincha onward. There is no need to return after nightfall to "see the candles" Friday night is no different. [see אורח חיים, תרעב א. בית יוסף שם - ערוך השולחן בסעיף ה], The halacha requiring on to see the candles after dark is only ON SHABBOS when the candles are for use of their light. But on chanukah all one needs is to light them at the correct time, ואין לנו רשות להשתמש בהם so there is no need to go back after dark.

  • How do you know this is true in a case where you light not outside and not near a window? What is the point of lighting then according to you? – Double AA May 16 '18 at 10:40
  • @DoubleAA - פרסומי ניסא for the household members (or himself) at the time of lighting. This is because the chachamim allowed him to do the mitzvah at that time. – RibbisRabbiAndMore May 16 '18 at 10:52
  • Is there Pirsumei Nisa before dark? How do you know? – Double AA May 16 '18 at 13:59
  • @DoubleAA I'll explain more clearly what I meant. The actual פרסומי ניסא has to be at night. שרגא בטיהרא מאי מהני - What is the benefit of a candle during daylight?. It is for this reason that the chzal made the original lighting time at שקיעה or צאת הכוכבים. BUT when one is יוצא לדרך he may light from פלג המנחה onward as long as it will still be burning after nightfall. Thus, from this we see that if the lighting takes place at a time when he was allowed to light, then he is yotze פרסומי ניסא even if it wasn't dark if it will burn until nightfall. – RibbisRabbiAndMore May 17 '18 at 8:28
  • That doesn't follow. All we see is Chazal allowed him to light before the time of Pirsumei Nisa, but perhaps they only allowed him to do that in such a way that Pirsumei Nisa would happen later. There is no proof that he is Yotzei Pirsumei Nisa earlier with a lighting which won't accomplish any Pirsumei Nisa Bizmanah – Double AA May 17 '18 at 13:41
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Easiest solution:

Give your dinner host a shavah perutah before shabbos to be a shuttaf in his candles. Since you are now a partial owner, you can be yotzei with their lighting of the jointly owned candles. There are similar solutions mentioned by lighting shabbos candles when you won't be/aren't home, though sources currently are eluding me.

  • Can you address what the point of lighting not where you sleep is? – Double AA Feb 17 '15 at 2:01
  • Nice discussion of lighting in shul that may be relevant. The point there was that a person is lighting where his home is in order to engage in pirsumei nisa with his family. No one lives in a shul to fulfill the precept of "ner ish ubeiso," so lighting there literally accomplishes nothing for nobody. See question 9 here - If the choice is between where you sleep and where you eat, you go with where you eat. Here, that is our only option. – Isaac Kotlicky Feb 17 '15 at 3:03

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