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It is well known that Jews of all strands are more stringent about Bishul Akum than Pat Akum or Pat Palter. If someone holds that Pat Akum is acceptable, does that mean bread can be bought from a restaurant that regularly makes large amounts of bread? Such examples would be pita, naan, or even bread rolls.

Given that these breads typically avoid any biblical non-kosher ingredients, would it be acceptable to purchase some that was made by a restaurant? Preference for Sephardic opinions.

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  • Interesting related article series: ou.org/torah/halacha/practical-halacha/… (beginning parts 2 and 3 seem to be most relevant for this question). Aug 9, 2019 at 0:01
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    (Or, a more popular alternative: malawach.) Am I missing something: If the individual holds it’s acceptable what exactly is the question?
    – Oliver
    Aug 9, 2019 at 0:06
  • @Oliver Because some people may feel it's acceptable for store or bakery bought bread, but it would never occur to them to buy from a restaurant.
    – Aaron
    Aug 9, 2019 at 0:26
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    @Aaron Never occurred to me there’s a difference between a bakery and a restaurant. What would it be?
    – Oliver
    Aug 9, 2019 at 1:07
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    2 points: 1) if it's at a restaurant or bakery, bread is more properly classified as pat palter than pat akum (palter is baked for profit and almost always permitted; akum for private use and almost always prohibited) and 2) naan is almost always slathered with ghee (clarified butter) which many would likely not accept as kosher without a hechescher Aug 9, 2019 at 3:19

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'Typically avoiding' isn't okay. Non-kosher restaraunts have a myriad of non-kosher ingredients, utensils, and products being baked. As long as they aren't basically making only matzah (with just flour and water), it would be a problem, and there is most probably non-kosher in the food.

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  • I think this answer is the bottom line. A restaurant oven at a non-certified restaurant is highly problematic. Apr 2, 2023 at 13:38
  • @יהושעק Yup, it will be very hard to nob be oiver issurim - at the least, maaras ayin.
    – Kovy Jacob
    Apr 3, 2023 at 0:15
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From a strictly theoretical perspective, bread has the halachic leniency of pat paltar (baked by a professional) that does not exist with regards to bishul akum. That's very clear on the books.

In the US at least, most who use pat paltar will still want a rabbi who checked out the ingredients and equipment -- they just don't care if a Jew turned on the oven. It's a much dicier proposition to hope that "eh the ingredients here should be fine." (I've heard that at least in the past, many French Jews assumed baguette is okay from a boulongerie but not a patisserie, once they've checked out the oils -- again, consult your rabbi. The former type of store is dedicated to bread and there are fewer kosher-ingredients concerns compared to the latter, which also makes cakes and pastries.)

Strictly speaking, the logic of pat paltar (given the perceived need for bread as a dietary staple Talmudically, the high costs of baking equipment, and the negligible likelihood of blurred social lines from a commercial relationship rather than a personal one) should apply whether the sign on the door says BOB'S BAKERY or BOB'S RESTAURANT & BAKERY. However, a lot more things could go wrong kosher-ingredients-wise in the latter case, unless you know a lot of very detailed information about their kitchen.

If you're asking about what grain products are covered by the halachic dispensation of pat paltar (assuming the ingredients check out) -- okay it works for bread, what about cake, doughnuts, pancakes, pasta ... suggest you ask that as a more-specific question.

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  • There was one opinion 'on the books' that Bishul also has a leniency of Palter (Maharit? Maharich? Mahar-something.)
    – Double AA
    Jun 9, 2021 at 20:29
  • Important note: Baguette is ok only a specific baguette the BAGUETTE TRADITION CUITE A MEME LA SOLE, the last baguettes are not allowed because of possible mixture of non Casher or Chalavi ingredients
    – kouty
    Jun 9, 2021 at 20:36
  • @DoubleAA in hachi nami ... for these purposes I figured stick with normative halachic practice ... of course they say something from the Chida about if it's far-flung production ...
    – Shalom
    Jun 9, 2021 at 20:47
  • @kouty thank you. I knew there were more details, but that highlights the point -- you really, really have to know what you're doing about the ingredients. I think the questioner may have missed that.
    – Shalom
    Jun 9, 2021 at 20:48

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