I was at a shiva minyan this morning but the mourner was not there (he was running late from the airport and some people could not wait). He showed up in the middle and went in to another room, then to the basement where we started another minyan. The following questions emerged:

would the minyan without the mourner follow the shiva-minyan practices (no tachanun etc) if he was

A) in the room but not davening

B) in the house, not davening

C) in the house davening but not with that minyan

I can imagine a case where the mourner davens with his minyan, and then many people show up and set up another minyan -- the mourner says kaddish during it, and is in the room for it, but isn't "part" of it. Would it matter if he, though he davened already, was number 10?

Related to this, but my cases all happen in the beit avel.


1 Answer 1


I found it on the OU site:

Tachanun is not recited in a house of mourning even if the mourners are not present (Shaarei Teshuva OC 131:10).

  • 1
    Does the site define a "house of mourning"? The aveil had not come home from the airport so he had not sit in his house when the first minyan began. When he showed up, he went right to daven so he did not sit then either.
    – rosends
    Jun 26, 2019 at 20:35
  • @rosends That's an interesting question. I'm surmising that it is the home that an aveil owns and at some point, he will be present. Which seems to exclude both - 1) if no aveilim will be there during the week and 2) A guest's home (unrelated to the aveil) while the aveil is not present.
    – DanF
    Jun 26, 2019 at 20:43
  • When I sat, I started in Israel, came back to the US, sat in my house very briefly then my parents' house for the balance. Was each a beit aveil even when I wasn't there and before I showed up?
    – rosends
    Jun 26, 2019 at 23:54
  • @rosends - Yup. Same scenario as I had a few years ago. (Wish I had more time to spend in Israel, then.) In short, I sense that a "mourning house" requires at least one aveil to be somewhere in the house. If all of them went to daven in shul, and someone wants to make a minyan in their home while they are out, hmmm ... But if no aveil was there yet, even if he owns the home, I don't think that qualifies. Likewise, if all aveilim leave to go elsewhere, I think the "house" loses its status. Of course, all of these question why does someone want to visit a home where there are no aveilim?
    – DanF
    Jun 27, 2019 at 15:22
  • B"N, I will try to ask my rav about this, though, I sense he may not know the answer much more than me until we both research. But, he may have a better idea as to where to find the answers. I'm going to ad a separate question as to what defines a "bet aveil"?
    – DanF
    Jun 27, 2019 at 15:24

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