Timeline for Is there any benefit to an adult with the general mental capacity of a child of around 6 months wearing Tefillin?
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
33 events
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| Aug 17, 2018 at 21:41 | comment | added | SAH | @user2817 I also think there is some merit in considering how much--or little--we really know about what these people perceive. | |
| May 8, 2018 at 18:28 | comment | added | SAH | @user2817 I beg that you and others do whatever you can to help this person, and especially this person, put on tefillin. I believe in the merit of this with my whole heart for reasons I cannot begin to explain. More compellingly, the Lubavitcher Rebbe emphatically believed that such people should do mitzvos l'maaseh, and wrote many letters on this topic. Please read them, and show them to your community, if possible: friendshipcircle.org/blog/2017/04/07/… | |
| May 8, 2018 at 13:04 | answer | added | Yerucham David ben Mordecai | timeline score: -1 | |
| Sep 4, 2016 at 19:07 | comment | added | kouty | a man with a profund mental disability is of course defined by Halacha as Shoyte. mitsvot has no sense for him, mitsvot are not theurgic rituals and not designed to improve etc. Mitsvot are mitsvot | |
| Sep 4, 2016 at 18:14 | history | bumped | CommunityBot | This question has answers that may be good or bad; the system has marked it active so that they can be reviewed. | |
| Aug 5, 2016 at 19:07 | history | tweeted | twitter.com/StackJudaism/status/761639862197972993 | ||
| Aug 5, 2016 at 17:52 | answer | added | DonielF | timeline score: 2 | |
| Dec 23, 2015 at 8:55 | history | reopened |
Avrohom Yitzchok sabbahillel mevaqesh Scimonster Danny Schoemann |
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| Dec 22, 2015 at 15:19 | comment | added | mevaqesh | This depends on whether one view the mitzvos as theurgic rituals (as per the kabbalah) or as acts designed to improve man and society ethically and intellectually. (Rambam) if one adopts the latter view then it s certainly pointless to perform the act of a mitzva when it is not required and the performer is not aware. On the other hand, if one adopts the former view then it is conceivable that the act itself has supernatural implication. In this realm it is not inconceivable that the act of one who is not required to perform a mitzvah, or aware of its performance, would achieve results. | |
| Dec 22, 2015 at 12:33 | comment | added | Daniel | @AvrohomYitzchok I think the edited version of the question has the same issue as the original version. | |
| Dec 22, 2015 at 10:06 | comment | added | Avrohom Yitzchok | @Daniel and others - please note edit to the question. | |
| Dec 22, 2015 at 10:03 | review | Reopen votes | |||
| Dec 23, 2015 at 8:55 | |||||
| Dec 22, 2015 at 9:48 | history | edited | user2817 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
I have edited my question as per the suggestion of Avrohom Yitzchok
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| Dec 21, 2015 at 22:17 | comment | added | Daniel | @user2817 You may not like the answer about the passuk (as I suspected you wouldn't). But the fact of the matter is, that answer would answer your question as currently worded. That's the entire reason the question is closed. It's not because there isn't an answer to the question you mean to ask. There may very well be good responses to the issues that you have alluded to. But if you don't mention which arguments you want refutations to, a trivial answer would work. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 21:57 | comment | added | Avrohom Yitzchok | I suggest you reword the question as below: I assume that an adult with the general mental capacity of a child of around 6 months is free from mitzvos. Would there be any benefit to (the neshomo of) this adult in getting his body to do mitzvos like tzitzis or tefillin asuming that his body was clean for the requisite period ? | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 19:59 | history | closed |
Daniel sabbahillel Gershon Gold Danny Schoemann msh210♦ |
Needs details or clarity | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 19:28 | comment | added | LN6595 | @DanF Which it's not. A Shoteh in the Gemara's terms is clearly exempt from all mitzvos. That doesn't mean he CAN'T do mitzvos, though. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 18:43 | comment | added | DanF | For numerous years, A cheresh was exempt from all mitzvoth, as in the time of the Gemarah, it was assumed that a cheresh was considered "unintelligent". For numerous years, there was a debate on exactly what cheresh meant, and the majority of recent (past 30 - 40 years) rulings have been that one who is deaf & uses sign-language is intelligent and is required to wear tefillin. I'm using this as a possible analogy to show that your case may be similar, if intelligence is a factor, here. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 18:12 | comment | added | user2817 | Regarding Daniel's comment, I think that the Biblical verse isn't really a sufficient answer. Hence the Torah Shebaal Peh. I am aware of all the reasons why a person with his condition shouldn't put on Tefillin and it is these reasons that spur me to understand alternative opinions. And most importantly, if there are good reasons why he should, how can they override the obvious reasons that he shouldn't? | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 18:08 | comment | added | user2817 | I am not so sure it should be closed so quickly. I was looking into the discussion that Danno quoted. There is a conversation there about whether Mitzvos Tzrichos Kavvana. There may also be the concept of the Neshomo and that even someone who is both physcially unable to put on Tefilin and mentally unable to understand what he is doing nevertheless his Neshomo may benefit from the activity. I was wondering if anyone had some insight or source material to clarify this. I was't looking for a P'sak but rather insight and "reid". | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 17:56 | comment | added | Daniel | @LN6595 Our job isn't to provide kulot. In any case, even if it was, we need to understand what the issue is in the first place. What are we trying to prove? The Torah says "וקשרתם לאות על ידך והיו לטטפת בין עיניך". That sounds like a reason why someone "should" put tefillin on. Is that a good enough reason for the OP? If not, why not? It doesn't address any potential issues with that person wearing tefillin but the OP specifically says he/she doesn't care to hear about those issues. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 17:06 | comment | added | LN6595 | +1 This is a valid question asking for arguments given to support a Halachik opinion. Needing a psak from a Rav is not a reason to close. There can be many reasons the OP needs a Kulah in this matter. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 15:52 | comment | added | CashCow | I agree it should be closed for that reason, but I do not have enough rep to vote to close. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 15:31 | comment | added | sabbahillel | Each case is different. There can be a case in which he is physically unable but mentally capable of understanding and a case of being physically capable but mentally unable to understand what he is doing and all the variations along that spectrum. It should be closed as needing a psak from someone who understands the particular case. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 15:11 | comment | added | rosends | some relevant discussion hearos.blogspot.com/2012/10/… | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 14:52 | history | edited | Isaac Moses♦ |
edited tags
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| Dec 21, 2015 at 14:44 | review | Close votes | |||
| Dec 21, 2015 at 20:00 | |||||
| Dec 21, 2015 at 14:42 | comment | added | CashCow | The obvious reason why he shouldn't is that he might let off wind as he would not know the significance of this prohibition. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 14:41 | comment | added | CashCow | I am not sure if this should be closed as really it's the kind of thing you should ask a rav? I have a son who is likely to be in the same situation. Now 10 years and 7 months old. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 14:28 | comment | added | rosends | related judaism.stackexchange.com/a/61864/1362 for why not. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 14:26 | comment | added | Daniel | The question that you've asked is not really answerable. If there are particular reasons that you've heard why he "shouldn't" that you'd like to find rebuttals for, please include those here. As it is, you're simply asking us to cherry-pick arguments that probably don't hold much weight on their own. I have voted to close this question for now. Assuming it does get closed, you can still edit the question to be clearer and then the question can be re-opened. | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 14:24 | comment | added | Daniel | Well there are lots of potential reasons why he "should." What is considered an important enough reason to be an acceptable answer to this question? Would the simple fact that he wants to do it count as a reason why he should? Maybe the simple fact that his parents want him to? | |
| Dec 21, 2015 at 14:18 | history | asked | user2817 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |