Timeline for Should I say shmei or shmeh?
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
20 events
| when toggle format | what | by | license | comment | |
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| Mar 19, 2016 at 8:31 | history | tweeted | twitter.com/StackJudaism/status/711107849951301632 | ||
| Nov 24, 2013 at 2:53 | comment | added | Double AA♦ | related judaism.stackexchange.com/q/9843/759 | |
| Nov 18, 2013 at 11:37 | comment | added | Shimon bM | I think that the most important thing to note here is that shortening the tzeire doesn't change the meaning of the word, but not pronouncing the heh does. | |
| Nov 18, 2013 at 9:09 | answer | added | MoriDowidhYa3aqov | timeline score: 0 | |
| Oct 8, 2013 at 22:18 | comment | added | josh waxman | Who are they in your question? | |
| Oct 8, 2013 at 9:48 | comment | added | rotten | are they also pronouncing ע pharyngeally? is their ת a "th" sound? if not, it seems strange to single out the ה as an "improperly pronounced" letter. | |
| Oct 7, 2013 at 17:30 | history | edited | msh210♦ | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
clarify per OP's comments on the Q
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| Oct 7, 2013 at 3:07 | answer | added | josh waxman | timeline score: 2 | |
| Oct 7, 2013 at 2:22 | comment | added | josh waxman | Also, we are not conjecturing a theoretic "correct" pronunciation, to the exclusion of all others. Given this standard pronunciation, and positing "correctness" as remaining consistent within a tradition, which is the right way to go? Are people really gaining, as they think they are? | |
| Oct 7, 2013 at 2:19 | comment | added | josh waxman | but yes, i then retract the line of discourse above, "ah..." | |
| Oct 7, 2013 at 2:18 | comment | added | josh waxman | nice. but that doesn't mean that this is the case for every diphthong. so /aw/ as cholam above. iirc, there is no distinction among Masoretes between tzeirei malei and tzeirei chaser. they are both full vowels. and i am not saying any different. This diphthong is thoroughly integrated into the language, more so than something like patach yud. Are you saying that you DON'T pronounce tzeirei as a diphthong? | |
| Oct 7, 2013 at 1:36 | comment | added | Double AA♦ | @joshwaxman In this weeks parsha we have ואעשך לגוי גדול with a dagesh kal in the gimmel of גדול because of the consonantal yod in לגוי. Similarly קלוי באש in Vayikra 2:14 and וחי בהם in Vayikra 18:5 (to give you examples of different vowels). Why would a mappik yud be different from a mappik hey לה or a mappik vav עבדיו? | |
| Oct 6, 2013 at 23:48 | comment | added | Seth J | @Josh, I'm not sure it's so impossible, since that's how (I think) I pronounce it. But if you think I'm wrong, who cares how you try to pronounce it? | |
| Oct 6, 2013 at 23:45 | comment | added | josh waxman | ah. now i see what you are getting at. no, i don't agree that a consonantal yud would close the syllable. | |
| Oct 6, 2013 at 23:40 | comment | added | Double AA♦ | @joshwaxman Unless the י is consonantal ("mappik"). If you are going to add a consonant to the sound, then it closes the syllable. | |
| Oct 6, 2013 at 23:35 | comment | added | josh waxman | @SethJ, +1. that is going to part of my answer. But it is phonologically nearly impossible to go against the grain, I think. | |
| Oct 6, 2013 at 23:25 | comment | added | josh waxman | @DoubleAA, I don't understand your q. Why should I? Are we talking past each other? A word ending in אהוי, the next word does not have a dagesh kal... | |
| Oct 6, 2013 at 23:19 | comment | added | Seth J | Second, if you are convinced it's incorrect, what's wrong with going against the grain (especially if it's such a subtle thing that, as you pointed out, most people probably don't even pick up on it)? | |
| Oct 6, 2013 at 23:17 | comment | added | Seth J | First, what makes you think shortening the vowel in speech is incorrect? You're talking about a language that hasn't been spoken conversationally in a really long time. | |
| Oct 6, 2013 at 21:53 | history | asked | josh waxman | CC BY-SA 3.0 |