Timeline for What's the best way to dip maror into charoset if you're using horseradish?
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| Mar 23, 2013 at 9:56 | comment | added | Michoel | @DoubleAA I searched for a specific explanation of the custom to combine, and didn't find anything. My guess is that some Achronim claim that horseradish is actually better than Romaine lettuce because it is bitter (and the lettuce they had then was different), so the custom may be a compromise. | |
| Mar 21, 2013 at 23:53 | comment | added | Double AA♦ | @Michoel Any news on my above comment? Why bother with the horseradish at all? | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 4:20 | comment | added | Michoel | @Fred Note that I was not claiming this is the most ideal solution; only that there would be an advantage to also eating Romaine lettuce and I was answering OP's question how to dip if you are using horseradish. I am looking for an explanation for the Chabad custom to not use only Romaine lettuce, but haven't found anything yet. | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 4:02 | comment | added | Fred | I disagree that the Shulchan Aruch would consider a mixture that includes lettuce to be ideal. He writes "ועיקר המצוה בחזרת", which seems to convey that lettuce alone is ideal, though he holds that it is acceptable to mix. According to the Aruch HaShulchan such a minhag does specifically exist, and as you mentioned it is the minhag of Chabad. However, I don't think this would be the most ideal approach according to the Shulchan Aruch. ping @MonicaCellio | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 4:02 | comment | added | Double AA♦ | You say you get the advantage of eating lettuce and you can mix other things in. Why eat the horseradish at all though? | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 3:55 | vote | accept | Monica Cellio | ||
| Mar 18, 2013 at 3:48 | history | edited | Michoel | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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| Mar 18, 2013 at 3:27 | comment | added | Monica Cellio | Thanks @Michoel. Could I persuade you to add that information (that this mixing is permitted, and even that romaine is preferred) to your answer? | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 3:25 | comment | added | Michoel | @MonicaCellio It is clear from Shulchan Aruch that one may mix two types of bitter herbs. Fred was pointing out that there may be an opinion that it is preferable not to, but that opinion is not codified in Shulchan Aruch, and the Chabad custom is specifically to mix. It is unquestionably better than eating the marror with matza, and also has the advantage of eating Romaine lettuce as well which Shulchan Aruch states is actually preferable to horseradish. | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 3:19 | comment | added | Monica Cellio | @msh210, Michoel -- I was asking about using horseradish and had never considered the possibility that one could combine that with another bitter food. The people coming to my seder will expect horseradish, but if it's actually kosher to use romaine to hold it, that's a nice solution. (I can't tell from the comment discussion about that "if" yet; is there anything that should be added to the answer to make the issues clearer?) | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 2:06 | comment | added | msh210♦ | I thought that was what it meant. Obviously, if so, then it was ambiguous. +1. | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 1:33 | comment | added | Michoel | @msh210 Not sure what you mean? Was the question asking what to do if you use only horseradish? | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 1:26 | comment | added | msh210♦ | I suppose this technically answers the question, which doesn't actually specify "what do you do if you use horseradish for maror?", but I thought that was the plain meaning. | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 1:01 | comment | added | Michoel | @Fred Rabbi Chaim Ashkenazi in his commentary to Shulchan Aruch Harav (Hilchot Leil Haseder to OC 473:30) questions whether the Chabad minhag is to have kezayitz in total, or a kezayitz of each (or at least of the chazeres). In my experience I have only seen a kezayitz in total used. | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 0:51 | comment | added | Fred | Interesting minhag (but note that the Shulchan Aruch does not suggest that it is preferable to use a mixture, and in fact he rules that romaine lettuce is preferable). | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 0:45 | comment | added | Michoel | @Fred Shulchan Aruch (473:5) rules lehalacha that one can combine the five different types of Maror to make up a kezayitz. This is the Chabad custom (as recorded in Sefer Haminhagim Chabad). See also Aruch Hashulchan (:14). | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 0:37 | history | edited | Michoel | CC BY-SA 3.0 |
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| Mar 18, 2013 at 0:26 | comment | added | Fred | Also, the S'fas Emes infers that Rashi would prohibit a non-50-50 mixture from adding up to a k'zayis (ad loc): יש לדייק מלשון רש"י ז"ל דדוקא שני חצאי זיתים מב' מינים כיון שהם שוים ואין מין האחד יותר מהמין האחר מצטרפין אבל אם הרוב ממין אחד אין מצטרף מיעוט ממין אחר להשלים השיעור משום דנתבטל טעם מרירות מין המועט בהרוב וחסר לי' משיעוריה. | |
| Mar 18, 2013 at 0:18 | comment | added | Fred | Assuming you use less than a k'zayis of lettuce and horseradish each (and I'm not actually assuming this), this brings up the issue of combining different kinds of maror for one k'zayis, which Rashi (P'sachim 39a, s.v. ומצטרפין) implies is not preferable. Generally, romaine lettuce is preferred to anything else, no matter how bitter the alternative is (see the story with Ravina and Rav Acha son of Rava on the middle of 39a). | |
| Mar 17, 2013 at 23:52 | history | answered | Michoel | CC BY-SA 3.0 |